A note of caution regarding Winks. The current Spurs midfield is the Kingdom of the Blind. Oliver Skipp has walked into the Spurs midfield and is without doubt the best midfield player on Spurs books. That tells you something.
The real story here is that Lo Celso, Ndombele, and Winks have been collectively and consistently so unfit for purpose, over a sustained 3-year period, that Spurs performances and results have suffered massively.
There has been a limited supply to the forward players and the defenders have often been left exposed. Poch, Jose, Nuno, and now Conte have tried different tactics and operated a revolving cast in midfield, but the same recurring problems are evident; especially when Spurs come up against a decent team.
When Winks plays for Spurs, against an elite team, it is a bit like watching the football equivalent of a giant placing the palm of his hand against a midget’s forehead; whilst the midget swings punches that never land.
Spurs played Morecambe yesterday. A-League One side. When Wink’s has done well, it has typically been against inferior opposition in the Europa League or domestic cups. The Winks ‘renaissance’ is one of the more unfortunate consequences of Spurs’ improvement, in terms of performance and results, under Antonio Conte.
Harry Winks is not the answer. Those who think he might need to ask themselves what the question is. Winks has scored 2 goals and contributed 2 assists in 116 Premier League appearances.
His statistics on winning 1v1 duels make dismal reading. Winks does not win the majority of his tackles. This is a player who does not score, create or stop goals. I have been baffled about what Winks is bringing to the party from early on. Without wishing to be unkind; it’s not enough. Spurs is as good as it gets for Winks. He knows it.
He knows that a significant minority of Spurs supporters also know it. He is embracing the reprieve that has come his way due to the utter uselessness of both Ndombele and Lo Celso. Conte will Tolerate Winks for a while; but not for long. Hojbjerg and Skipp are the only current midfield survivors of this disaster.
Football is a pretty simple game in my opinion. The best sides are balanced with the fittest, strongest, left and right footed players who can score, create or stop goals being scored.Think about the best Spurs teams you have watched over a few seasons or the other teams, you don’t support, that have caught your eye, playing good football and win things.
The very best players are often those who can play comfortably with both feet. In my lifetime I have been fortunate enough to have seen Hoddle, Ginola, King, Berbatov and Vertonghen.
Different types of players but all of these players were good enough to play their way out of trouble on their weaker foot. They could innovate instinctively. They almost didn’t have to think about what they were trying to do.There have been others but these 5 are probably the best example of what I am talking about. Very gifted and intelligent players.
Spurs current problems are predominantly in the midfield. The midfield players that Spurs have used in the last three seasons are simply not good enough at anything they are required to do consistently well.
Midfield players need to be able to create, score or stop goals being scored. It’s stating the obvious but true nonetheless. The best midfield players excel in at least one of the ‘create, score or stop goals’ departments and are at least average in the other two departments.
Harry Winks excels in none of these departments. He’s not even average in any of these departments. He is poor in all three of the ‘create, score or stop goals’ criteria that is a necessary requirement for a top professional football player.
Winks only use for the team could be as a substitute from the bench, in order to retain possession of the ball, when the team are two or three goals to the good. He could be used in this capacity to run the clock down and allow other, more talented, players to have a rest.
Harry Winks should never ever have played over 150 first team games for THFC. The fact that he has does not sit well with me.
Has “winksy” been limited by the incumbent coach’s tactics
On the few occasions, an England game incl, where he has been given a more advanced,attacking brief , he has been good. He should be given a run under conte, whom I trust to identify whether winksy is up to it.
If our MF is the weakest in the Div I dread to think where that puts our defence.
He moved the ball to slowly ,when the defence passes the ball quick and the wingback makes an advancing run passing 2 players winks gets the ball and delays with releasing it. In that time the opposition players recover . So all the effort was wasted by the wingbacks and the defenders . It’s a continuous cycle . Winks isnt the only 1 in the midfield who does that by the way. PEH and Skipp are also guilty of this too often. Our midfield doesnt work well together. I think winks will work well next too a true creative midfielder with PEH anchoring the midfield.
Winks Is never an attacking midfielder. He wont get into any other the other top 7 or 8 teams.He might be improving ,but it is not enough. He cannot dictate play,he does not regularly find any defence splitting passes. Ndombelend splits defence more often than winks. Unfortunately what spurs needs is someone who is strong in the centre who has creativity with tight ball control to move opposition from their positions. You dont find guys around easily and if you do its 70mill and upwards on punts(Ndombele was brought in as this) I have watched Ndomele before he joined spurs and was amazed by the stuff he done on the field. He was that good.He had this habit of being even better in the big games in france and in the champs league. I can’t blame Levy and Poch for going for him as everyone wanted him. He only came to spurs because of the wages we offered as lots of clubs were willing to match the transfer fee. I just dont know what happen to him in England. It’s like this is a complete different player. Maybe his salary increasing from 30k a week to 200k a week was to blame for that. dembele made us way way better.
Ward-Prowse is bang average, free-kicks aside. Absolutely not what we need in the slightest
I pray we dont get Mckennie. Not good enough
Not sure why people can’t just be happy Conte is getting a tune out of Winks, and sees in him a player he can trust.
He is breaking lines with passes, something we sorely lack. He isn’t ever going to be a defensive rock, but a top team doesn’t have seven defenders in it – which is essentially what we are going with currently.
Truth is he has looked better than Hojbjerg under Conte, but it is clear tattoos, shouting, and pointing makes people weak at the knees.
I remember vJamie Redknapp hitting a free kick which got us a draw v AFC at home . Jamie’s season had been marred by poor performances and significant injury..that free kick earned him a new contract.Pussy whipped board.
Earned him a new contract then he retired and focussed on his hair..3: 5 seasons off nothing.
My washing machine is running now ..you know what’s in it.
One wink does not mean a hot date marriage kids or civil marriage…there are worse you are right ..the irony here is that this is now the barometer of how we measure our squad. To think we were the founder members of the Elitist ESL…this is why we have an ESL squad …I that particular fantasy land results do not matter.
I thought Rose was decent for us never bottled out out in a shift..should’ve been replaced earlier but was bleed to death by the Kappelmeister.
I’m laughing so much i’ll need to change my pants!
As did a certain Danny Rose
Sadly I think you’re absolutely right here. When will this madness ever end?
Who in this team cost over 60 mil and earn more than 15 mil a year ? Your either arsenal West Ham or harry winks dad
He’s in the cells, smoking roll ups
Bye-bye Bertie
He was in the pants drawer, between ‘N’ and ‘W’
The way I see it is like this.
Think of the Spurs midfield players as individual pairs of pants.
So in this scenario your friend, (let’s call him Antonio), opens his underwear draw and selects a pair of pants with a capital ‘N’ on the back of them.
Antonio’s about to put them on when he notices their is a huge turd in them. A proper stinker. Antonio is, (quite rightly) appalled at the prospect of putting on this pair of pants. He promptly puts them in a carrier bag and throws them out of the window. He can’t even put them in the bin because they will stink the place out and upset everyone.
Feeling a little unsettled by this he returns to the underwear drawer and selects an alternative pair of pants with a capital ‘L’ and a capital ‘C’ on them. These pants look OK at first glance. They look as though they might do the job. Antonio is about to put one leg into these pants but all of a sudden he notices another turd. He can’t believe it! This turd was not as obvious as the one in the other pair of pants but upon closer inspection; this one stinks just as bad. Antonio discards the pants in disgust and considers complaining to his wife regarding the laundry regime but decides against it at this point in case he upsets her.
For the third time Antonio returns to the underwear drawer and selects the last pair of pants in the drawer. These pants have a capital ‘W’ on them. They look smashing. Encouraged by the appearance and presentation of the pants Antonio puts them on. For a few moments they feel comfortable but all of a sudden Antonio senses something is wrong. He hoiks the pants down and there is a huge skid mark right through the middle of the pants. They are a disgrace. However; they are the last pair in the drawer.
Antonio swallows deeply and pulls the pants back up. His pride is hurting. He knows this is wrong but what choice does he have? Feeling very sad and empty inside Antonio accepts the situation and carries on with the soiled pair of pants. He consoles himself with the thought they will have to do for now. However; his pride is hurt and he is struggling to come to terms with the situation.
What a put down more Rodney trotter than Rodney Dangerfield.
What about Sissoko where was he oh footballing genius
Barnes still had a great watfordl/liverpool career and Winks will never be able to lace his boots. Bentley, cult status? Are you sure you’ve not spelt it wrong!
I find you in contempt.
Mr Winks has been found guilty of all charges, by a jury of his peers, in relation to him being consistently mediocre, at best, over a very sustained period of time.
I have taken into account the fact that you have done your best to bring him up properly and he is indeed a lovely chap with a smashing haircut and infectious grin.
However; Spurs are a professional football club and as such cannot continue to fraudulently charge the highest ticket prices in the country while allowing your son to masquerade as a professional footballer.
You’ve had a good run but it’s time to move on.
Take them down.
I get it. But on the day where he was the best of a incredibly bad bunch it is he that is getting slagged off rather than guys who cost over 60 million and are earning 15 million a year. Can you not see the irony
John Barnes had a whole England career based on one mazey run against Brazil. David Bentley has cult status at WHL based on one goal against Woolwich.
At least Dele can say he’s living off a whole season, not one game! Dele scored plenty and made plenty of assists in that time, something which cannot be said of winks!
Triffic
That’s what he is. Whatever you think of him. That’s his role.
Christian Eriksen was an attacking midfield player.
Harry Winks is neither an attacking or defensive midfield player.
I’m not sure how you quantify what Harry Winks actually achieves during a football match so I try and stick to what I know for sure.
On the evidence I have seen; Harry Winks is very good at retaining possession of the ball. in neutral areas of the pitch, while under very little pressure, by passing the ball backwards, sideways and occasionally forward.
I’m not even taking the pi55. That is what he does.
I wouldn’t call winks an arttacking midfielder to be honest, more like a vinny sideways and crab wilkins mode player! And not as good as either of them either!
He can live off it , Dele Alli is still living off 2018…it how it works. Winks has looked better but this is a very poor Spurs team and worse squad…Winks is a better offensive player . I still cannot get over the throwing of the Zagreb game …Levy babe.
“Winks is an attacking MF”
With two goals and two assists in 116 games?
Marney played in central midfield that day. He scored 2 and got 1 assist for Robbie Keane. That is one assist short of what Harry Winks has achieved in 116 league games for Spurs.
You defeat your own argument. As you say. Look at who he had round him. Look who he’s had since. Look our defence then and look at it now. Both are chalk
and cheese.
It’s obviously beyond your blinkered view of Winks that you don’t recognise the then and now and further recognise how players respond to those around them.
You extol the virtues of Skip failing to acknowledge how bad we are defensively seeing he’s a defensive MF and how poor the service is to our forward players from any attacking MF option.
Winks is an attacking MF Skip isn’t. Why compare apples with oranges. The most telling thing about Winks recent games is he’s gone back being that attacking MF looking to get the ball forward. Something, that for whatever reason has been missing from his game. I put this down to the manager. The good thing is, Winks is responding. And for that, despite your assertion that a cone is a better option is to be applauded.
Ha Ha, that might explain it!
I reckon it’s Winksy’s dad.
Do you remember a Spurs academy player called Dean Marney? I remember him once playing an absolute blinder in a home game against Everton in the early noughties. I think he scored two; one of which was very special.
I don’t ever recall being sentimental about him four years later. One swallow or 116 Premier League games that have produced 2 goals, two assists and a truck load of heartache?
Oh come on, Winks can’t live off one performance over 3 years ago! He’s simply not good enough, how can you not except that? What seriously do you see in him? He seems a nice guy but he is just a very ordinary player and we need far far better than that!
More like case dissmissed
Final score 3 1
I also suggest you watch the goals we scored that night he was directly involved of two of them
Winks was hooked 1 minute after the third goal went in. Dembele came on to protect the lead. Case closed.
If Spurs were going to back Conte seriously they would have moved heaven and earth to get players in before the Chelsea and Arsenal games which will go along way towards defining this season.
It’s looking like more jam tomorrow isn’t it? It is more likely that Conte will leave in the summer than ENIC ever spending serious money on top players and the wages. As soon as Alistair Gold was getting the excuses in early for ENIC I think many of the old cynics like me now expect the same old nonsense.
Without Conte Spurs season was sunk and Levy was facing armageddon at a half full stadium.
The agony is being prolonged and patience will soon run out with these penny pinching bluffers.
With Villa getting their act together time is running out for Levy.
There may be trouble ahead.
Hopefully Levy is smart enough to know that he can’t bluff his way through / out of this any longer.
When Winks was hooked we were already 3 goals to the good so Moussa great player that he was didn’t oversee our victory.
I’m not sure what point the Kosher kid is trying to make. Skipp best midfielder at the club, better than Pierre?
Yesterday he was best player in our starting eleven yet he has come in for criticism even though his goal changed/saved the game for us.
Why are there no articles criticising the (Non) performances in no particular order of Docherty,Rodon,Tanganga,Lo celso, Tanguy, Dele who were all dog shit yesterday.
Winks is no Iniesta but when we start discarding players there are plenty who need to be moved on before him
The old ‘Real Madrid at Wembley’ cliche getting rolled out again by the Winks apologists.
For the record; Winks was one member of a five man Spurs midfield on the night.
Trippier – Eriksen – Dier – Winks – Davies.
He had Dier to his right and Davies to his left to make the tackles, blocks and interceptions. He also had Dele Alli floating about all over the shop.
The other fact that is often overlooked about Winks ‘legendary’ performance was that he was hooked on 66 minutes for Moussa Dembele; a truly magnificent and gifted Spurs midfield player who oversaw Spurs closing this one out.
We have a squad full of sub quality players that Levy has bought over the years and he’ll have trouble moving them on. We have to get away from the Levy style signing and back Conte 100% or I can see Conte walking away from Spurs early, that won’t bode well for Levy and Lewis as the fans have been well and truly won over by Conte in just a few weeks, he has the trust of the fans, it’s time the board showed the same trust and backed him financially. Bring in top quality signings, it may cost more initially but it will save you money in the long run, just look at all the players we need to move on and how much they’ve cost, if you buy quality, not only will they hold their value or even increase but you’ll need to buy fewer players.
The old ‘Real Madrid at Wembley’ cliche getting rolled out again by the Winks apologists.
For the record; Winks was one member of a five man Spurs midfield on the night.
Trippier – Eriksen – Dier – Winks – Davies.
He had Dier to his right and Davies to his left to make the tackles, blocks and interceptions. He also had Dele Alli floating about all over the shop.
The other fact that is often overlooked about Winks ‘legendary’ performance was that he was hooked on 66 minutes for Moussa Dembele; a truly magnificent and gifted Spurs midfield player who oversaw Spurs closing this one out.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/41821993
Winks is a little different, against poorer opposite he’s done well (yes he had that evening against RM). But that never consistently translates against teams in the top half of the Premier league or Europe .
Though hes not progressed and compared to Skipp(4 years younger) is his potential less due to the years he’s now been around?
So the question is can Conte train him well enough that his playing is more instinctive and snappier so he spent need that extra second? Conte likes him in the group we’ve got, so he’s likely going to be around until summer 2023 at the earliest baring an offer we cannot refuse.
One good game against real madrid (and over 3 years ago) doesn’t make up for all the times he’s been a waste of space. Even John Lacy had a good game once! (One for H and the other 70’s 80’s crew to cringe and remember!)
Conte’s system relies on (quality wing backs, but also…) a central midfield partnership where one of the 2 offers a bit more going forward yet remains solid when out of possession. This is why we are being linked with the likes of Kessie and Weston McKennie.
Think along the lines of Ward-Prowse, Loftus-Cheek etc.Really it should be ONE of Hoj, Winks or Skipp playing with someone like this.
I think when we eventually get a player that fits the bill we will improve dramatically. Somebody with a tocuh more creativity and/or a decent long shot on them to push up and support the front 3 when we are in possession is quite patently missing at the moment
Our midfield is ordinary to say the least and must be one of the weakest in the division, so it’s no surprise that it offers so little going forward, the over reliance on the WB’s to supply chances continues to fail yet we persevere. I don’t think it’s the strikers that are fully to blame it’s the lack of creativity, and until that is sorted along with quicker incisive passing and a player who runs at defenders, we struggle on.
There’s not one player from that starting eleven on Sunday that you’d miss. They offered nothing and but for subs we’d have been the giant killer of the round. That’s truly an appalling situation to have allowed happen over the past 3 years and will take several transfer windows and a lot of money to sort out.
Spot on. Conte must know this by now and will give them til the summer window to sort it.
100% agree with this. Our midfield has been non-existent since Dembele was let loose and Ericksen switched off regarding the eternal promised land that never arrived under ENIC and Levy. We have no transition from defence to the forward players. That is as much to do with Kane’s lack of comparative form this season as his “mindset”.The same with Son. These two along with Loris are our only truly world-class players that could walk into virtually any other top-flight side. The rest of this sorry bunch would struggle to get into any midtable EPL side or a second-tier European outfit. Kane and Son will pin defences back and score regularly if they have the same quality behind them providing them with the service they need. At the moment with the current set up we are using defenders as wing-backs who cannot beat a man and provide decent crosses or balls into the front players and we have two defensive midfielders dropped deep who also struggle to distribute the ball accurately. What we see time and time again is Loris roll the ball out to a back three player and then we play tippy tappy for three or more sideways or backward passes before someone like Dier or Davies tries to hit a long pass which invariably goes straight to an opposing player and they launch a counter-attack. If we populate the midfield with the right quality then the whole team can push forward and if that quality can cross well and slide balls through the channels then Kane and Son will operate in the areas where they are most dangerous. I mean come on…this is not rocket science and you do not have to be paid millions to see this. The problem is and remains the owners and chairman’s reluctance to invest for success on the football pitch because they are not football club owners at heart they are land and property developers who need to give the impression of a desire for success to keep the punters onside and their wallets open. If they did have a genuine desire for football success then they would surely go down in history as one of the most incompetent owners of a football club ever based on achievements and trophies over the past two-plus decades
The kosher kid is fully entitled to his view but I’m more some of the points he makes are valid.
Skipp best midfield player at the club I think our Danish Pierre might have something to say about that
Winks only does well against inferior opposition. Where was Kk on the night when we beat that pub side Real Madrid at Wembley probably fressing on a salt beef sandwich, I’m Jewish by the way.